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[icon] Man, the music industry is fucked - Patti
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Subject:Man, the music industry is fucked
Time:06:13 am
ASCAP wants to collect public performance licensing fees for cell phone ringtones.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-05 08:40 pm (UTC)
I'm inclined to agree with ASCAP actually.
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whipartist
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-05 08:45 pm (UTC)
Really? What's your reasoning?

Do I also owe public performance fees whenever I have my windows down in the car, or when I'm playing my stereo so loudly that the neighbors might hear?
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 05:18 am (UTC)
Do you pay a fee to have that song so you can broadcast it? If it's from the radio, no, but that's covered. If it's from a CD, then yes, you did pay, but the appropriate people are supposed to have been paid, as sales can be monitored. People blasting it from the car can't be, in practical terms.

Ringtone downloads are easily monitored, and as the article points out, the providers USED to pay the fees, but then decided to stop in light of a semi-irrelevant ruling. I don't know the fee structure for ringtone downloads, but given the wide availability of hit songs, I imagine it's a flat fee, and I'm not sure that's fair to the artists.

Mind you, this is my "spent time in the micro end of the music industry and made himself more familiar with aspects of copyright law than the average asshole venue owner in Denton" perspective. :)

Edited at 2009-07-06 05:19 am (UTC)
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tigerknight
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 07:54 pm (UTC)
How would you manage the fact that either the ringtone itself isn't a full song, or that the receiver of the call isn't going to listen to the whole thing before picking up? Are you going to cut down the cost of royalties based on the percentage of the song that the ringtone is, or on the average pickup time of the recipient? Also what about people with phones like mine where ringtones ARE purchased (I have no way to just add my own tune snippet), do I have to pay royalties on top of that even though I already purchased it (at a stupidly high cost for the 5 second clip, I might add - you can get half an album on iTunes for less)?

It's nonsense.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:01 pm (UTC)
I think a lower rate for ringtones in light of the lower price is a reasonable expectation.

You, individually, do not have to pay said royalties. That's all handled on the back end, as it always has been.

As for paying too much for ringtones, I understood them to be a buck or two, so I don't know what you're doing, but I'm sorry for it.

Me, I make my own ringtones, so I feel bad for people who have phones that don't allow that.
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tigerknight
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:06 pm (UTC)
My primary complaint with my sidekick is the ringtone functionality (or lack of, rather). $2 seems to be the going rate for 5-9 seconds of song in the downloads catalog I have access to, which is an abhorrent cost when you can neither choose the part of the song you want or actually find the songs you want to begin with in my case.

Unless I get a developers kit and circumvent that particular roadblock, there's nothing I can do to get ringtones.

As for who pays the royalties, do you seriously think that something like that is going to go into effect without a chunk of it getting kicked down to the customer?

I'll pass on the pity, thanks. I just want some flexibility and sanity in the industry.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:45 pm (UTC)
As the article mentions (though not specifically T-Mob), the companies involved used to pay the royalty, but stopped.

If the royalty were reinstated, do I think the companies would pass the cost back to the customer? It's possible.

As for the industry... in the cell industry, I think poor phone design and artificial roadblocks should definitely be done away with.
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whipartist
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:12 pm (UTC)
A buck or two for a ringtone seems absurd given that you can typically buy the entire song for a buck. Ringtones really should be on the order of about ten cents, though I can see going about as high as double that to cover the overhead.

I make my own as well.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:46 pm (UTC)
IIRC, it's more than 99 cents on iTunes to buy ringtones for iPhones and you have to jailbreak the phone if you want to make your own.

Oh well, guess I'll just sit over here with my Pre and do what I want...
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whipartist
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:48 pm (UTC)
Right. And that is ludicrous. You can buy the entire song for a buck, but buying a portion of it costs more.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 08:51 pm (UTC)
It's a value add!
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abostick59
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-05 11:50 pm (UTC)
If God wanted musicians to be justly compensated for their creations, She wouldn't let them sign contracts with major recoding labels.
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andrewhime
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-05 11:54 pm (UTC)
I fully agree with you, but one does not imply the other. There are plenty of indies who deal with ASCAP/BMI/SESAC.
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whitebird
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 02:18 am (UTC)
Your SFGate article comment has made it to the home page.
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whipartist
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 02:19 am (UTC)
COOL! Thanks for letting me know.
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whitebird
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 02:20 am (UTC)
I also took a screen capture in case it went away quickly.
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wordweaverlynn
Link:(Link)
Time:2009-07-06 03:10 am (UTC)
I'm surprised they don't do it already.
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[icon] Man, the music industry is fucked - Patti
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